Transcript 0:00 [upbeat music] Welcome back to the Latino Newsletter Podcast. I'm your host, Michelle Zacarias, and our guest today is the founder and co-host of the Tamarindo Podcast, Brenda Gonzalez. 0:11 Born in Puebla, Mexico, Brenda is a longtime Los Angeles resident. She is a political nerd, a fitness instructor, frequently speaks on issues of culture and identity. 0:23 Brenda's experiences as a formerly undocumented student shaped her interest in politics, and she founded Tamarindo in 2016 with the mission of using comedy and laughter to illuminate important issues impacting the Latino community. 0:39 Thank you for being here. My gosh, it's such a joy. Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be here with you. Yeah. 0:45 Well, first of all, let's talk about how you're coming up on the 10-year anniversary of the Tamarindo Podcast. So first of all, congratulations. 0:54 I wanted to start by saying I, I listen to your episodes and your style of commentating, and I love that each episode feels like you're just kind of chismeando with your girlfriend in the living room. 1:08 It just feels, like, so comforting and warm. And I wanted to know, what was your inspiration for setting that specific tone with your audience? Yeah. Well, okay. 1:20 Elder millennials might remember [laughs] there was a popular podcast, a BuzzFeed podca- podcast called Another Round. I loved this podcast. It was very casual. 1:30 And the other thing I really liked about the, the dynamics of the two hosts, there were, first, there were two Black women and they were a, a decade apart, the two of them. 1:37 So I think that added to, like, the breadth and, of what they could talk about. But anyways, I loved it. And at the time, I, I listened to that podcast regularly, and it was 2016. 1:49 There was a, the election, everything that's going on, and, and I just thought, like, that very casual approach was like, "I could do that." And exactly what you mentioned, like, just chismeando with your girlfriends. 1:58 I mean, we should have a podcast. We're so fun. You know? [laughs] Like, many people have said that, so I just kinda took that spirit and that inspiration of seeing something that I wanted to sort of model from. 2:09 And then my secret advantage is that I have a husband who's a music producer for fun. He had a studio. 2:16 We had something to model from, but I, I suppose what truly inspired it is just wanting to have a, like, Latina perspective or Latinx perspective to push back on what was going on politically at the time. 2:29 We are leading up to the 2016 election. Yeah. 2:33 And I do notice that you often alternate between heavy subject matters, like politics and, like, immigration and trans rights, and kind of fill in with some of the more lighthearted subjects, like children's books and fitness and, like, Bad Bunny. 2:49 Has hosting the Tamarindo Podcast changed how you personally process politics, especially during, like, really exhausting news cycles? 2:59 I think the, the opportunity of having this podcast made me sort of hone in on my voice, and sometimes there's comedy in that. [laughs] I do enjoy approaching things in a lighthearted way. 3:12 I mean, there's so- there's things that just, there is no room for lightheartedness, right? Especially right now, there's just so much heaviness. 3:18 But I do feel that w- when we are so tied up in the, in the calling out, in the heaviness, it could force people to tune out. So I like the idea of inviting people to come in. Like, I think that's important. 3:34 It's hard to do because there's so many times that it... 3:36 There, there are times where we do rant and do kind of insult people, but I know, like, how much more successful it is to want to inspire people, to motivate people, because I, I myself experience it, right? 3:49 When I see so much of the focus on the negative or, like, the helplessness, the hopelessness, it's like, well then what are we gonna do? Right? 3:57 [laughs] So I just think it's important to have some, some levity or something inspirational or motivational so that we could stay in this fight, so we could stay engaged, so we could stay motivated. 4:08 Yeah, I love that, and really just kind of leaning into community during these kind of treacherous moments. 4:15 I think on the topic of, like, belonging and community, I know you've talked a lot about kind of the importance of creating our own spaces, right? 4:25 And we often use this metaphor of, like, building our own table instead of bringing a seat to the table. Would you say that approach resonates more with you? 4:34 Do you feel like you've now created a space for yourself as opposed to trying to pigeonhole your way into something that doesn't exist for you? 4:43 What's been really fun to kind of launch off the audio space into the actual real world physical space with Tamarindo, one of the easiest and most, like, obvious ways that, that we started was, like, teaching others to have podcasts. 4:56 So we did a, a workshop to ch- like, go through, like, here's what we learned in the last five years of having this podcast. 5:02 So that's one way, like, building the community of other podcasters and we've, we've been in contact with other podcasters. 5:09 I think very early on there was even a, a Lat- an, an attempt to launch a Latino podcast network in LA. There was at least a festival, a festival that we participated early on. 5:19 So that's, like, one obvious way is just, like, the network of Latine podcasters, one thing. 5:25 But then because we realized how important it, it was to sort of think about self-care and, and personal development and making sure that we individually are well so that we can be engaged and then therefore be more impactful for our community, that's when we realized that we need to be doing activities that also fulfill that. 5:44 So we did, we've organized hikes before. 5:46 We've done events where the, the mission was to cultivate friendships, which we thought was really essential, especially after the pandemic when so many people were so isolated and disconnected. 5:57 And then really exciting, in 2023, we were able to host this really awesome restorative retreat in a cultural setting with our listeners, and that was phenomenal, and we're doing it for the third time this year. 6:10 So that's like-That's really the culmination of, of the community that we've built over the years to actually get people to come with us across the border and be together. 6:20 That's been so inspirational for me to see that we've been able to build that. Yeah, and I really love this idea of cultivating community in, like, different ways, right? 6:31 Like, not only through podcasting or writing or the work we do, but also through, like, fitness and wellness, and I know you're someone who's really kind of tapped into that. 6:41 Would you say i- in terms of what's missing from, like, the mainstream wellness culture, is there anything that you feel like culturally conscious or culturally relevant spaces can offer? Yes, I think definitely. 6:55 One thing is that we, we talk, we've, we've talked about wellness for a while on Tamarindo, and we always say that, you know, the systems are not built for us to thrive. So it's always the yes, and, right? 7:06 Like, yes, what can you do to be mindful, to mitigate, for example, your consumption of social media and the news? You know, those are things that we could all do, and that we have the power to do. 7:14 Or maybe even, like, financial planning. Yes, there's things we could do that could maybe alle- alleviate some of the stress that we might have around our financial planning. 7:21 But the truth is, we also need to do more about changing the systems that make us unhealthy or changing the systems that keep us in poverty. So it's, it's... 7:30 I think the cultural relevancy is, is recognizing that we're in a system that is not built for us, and that while it's important and, and crucial that we find these tools to make ourselves feel well and healthy, it's, it's that recognition that there are systemic changes that need to happen. 7:48 And so that's our goal. It's like, how can we call people in through the comedy, through the lightness, through the cultural relevant stuff, and then educate, but then also say, "Okay, great, now stay engaged," [laughs] 7:58 and like, let's take it a, a step further. Yeah, and so much of, like, wellness and health is really having difficult conversations within your community, right? I think I might have mentioned this to you before. 8:10 I'm a colorectal cancer survivor, and in the aftermath of, like, my recovery, some of the things that I was learning about was how disproportionately impacted the Latino community is, not just from colorectal cancer, but a lot of the common types of cancers. 8:25 And obviously there's, like, a environmental issue there. 8:29 There's something culturally that we're wanting to kind of address in terms of, like, talking about our health, talking about, like, the uncomfortable things that happen to your body when you start going through health issues, and why our people aren't seeking out early stage diagnosis, right? 8:47 Like, why aren't we seeking out health, healthcare, accessible healthcare? So I, I think that conversation is so important, especially in the fitness and wellness community, because it's often very, like, white-centric. 9:00 It's, like, very, like, self-care, yoga retreat style type situation, but I imagine, like, your version of this retreat has, includes a lot of that cultural competency. Can you talk a little bit about that? What was... 9:13 So you said you've done these retreats before. What was the agenda like for participants? Yeah. It's r- it really changed. So I'll give you the backstory. So Tamarindo has been around for 10 years. Our most... 9:26 And I've had several folks partner with me on this. Tamarindo's current co-host is Delci Sandoval, and Delci has a podcast herself called Ocupación. 9:34 And like me and you and a lot of people, you know, you're online friends first, and we were friends online, and she was living in New York at the time. She, when she was in LA, she said, "Hey, I'm in LA. 9:45 Let's meet in person," just as two fellow Latinas who have podcasts. And we met, and we immediately started brainstorming, like, "God, this was such a great meeting. 9:54 How do we create a space where more, you know, people like us that have these sort of social justice-leaning podcasts can come together?" 10:02 So that's where the idea first came from, and, and that our intent was first to maybe do it for other Latina podcasters, and I knew we needed to go broader than that. 10:11 So we went broader to, like, creatives, Latina creatives. So the first one was, it's still s- grounded in, like, a cultural setting, and we would get to do cultural activities, and we would get to do some self-care. 10:22 But then we would have some workshops, and the intent of the first one were workshops to foster creativity. So that's how it started. 10:29 It's like fostering creativity, and by the way, Delci is a therapist, so creativity as a tool to just help us cope with everything that's going on, as a tool to st- help us stay recharged and reconnect. 10:41 So that was year one. Now, Delci also became a parent, so she couldn't come year two. And so on year two I partnered with, uh, Wendy Amada, who's a, a coach. There's so many coaches. Look, there's so many coaches. 10:53 There's one for every day. But Wendy's a person that's been doing it for 18 years, and she also threw herself a party with the theme Fuck Trump. So Wendy is down. 11:01 So in the second year that we did it, it wasn't just people that were looking to cultivate something creative. 11:06 It ended up being a lot of, like, executive directors of nonprofits, a judge, you know, high-power attorneys that just, that are also, um, interested in, in taking a break, but knowing that they would be with other progressive, like-minded women in doing so. 11:21 So that's how it has evolved. [gentle music] I know you've said that you have lived in Los Angeles a really long time. 11:36 You were originally born in Puebla, Mexico, and you've shared a little bit about potentially wanting to return back to Mexico as a formerly undocumented person living in the US. 11:49 What emotions come up for you when you think about that as a possibility? Joy and excitement, and I can't wait. 11:56 [laughs] But I think the reason why, I mean, because I was someone that was formerly undocumented, there was definitely a big chunk of my time where I, where going back was, 12:07 like, outside of the realm of possibilities, right? Like, ever leaving the US was never gonna happen. 12:13 That, that was the mindset that I had for, for a while because of my, my situation.Luckily, I was able to become a resident, and, and just becoming a resident, wow, like what a ticket that opened up for me to be able to go back to Puebla and go to Mexico. 12:30 And so as an adult with my own resources, I- I've been able to go back to Mexico maybe two or three or four times a year sometimes. I'm a little, like, addicted to going [laughs]. 12:39 And I think with what's going on right now, I mean, I, I, I have really felt like, you know, we started Tamarindo in 2016 thinking this guy wasn't even gonna make it to be the president, and then whoa, we had to keep going because wow, and look at where we are now. 12:53 I mean, I think we, we knew it would be bad, but I, I don't think any of us could have imagined how absolutely heinous and horrible it is right now, where it just doesn't really feel like home. You know? It doesn't... 13:07 I don't feel necessarily welcome here. So I've been wanting to do this exploration of spending some time in Mexico, like, like a serious one or two or three-year stint in Mexico, and it has felt really more urgent now. 13:19 Like, in the past it was more like, gosh, wouldn't it be fun, like cultural, like reconnecting, but now it kind of feels almost essential. 13:26 So, so and I, I recognize that it, it's is a tremendous privilege to even be considering that, but it's something that I really hope to do w- while still earning US dollars. 13:38 I know that that comes with tremendous privilege and access and opportunity. And, and I'm also, like, with the way things are going, is there gonna be a day where I'm not even gonna be able to come back to the US? 13:47 I mean, there's a lot of talk of, of targeting naturalized citizens. So it- it feels really s- crazy to be thinking that way, but I'm not kinda, I'm not coming from a s- place of fear. 14:00 I really am going through, you know, from a place of hope, of like reconnecting with my cousins, with my family, with my roots, where I'm from, and mastering Spanish and, and, you know, seeing, 14:12 seeing that the world is so much bigger than just the US, right? The world is so much bigger, and there's more for us to be tapping into and exploring. 14:19 Being able to say, "Okay, now I get to make the choice one way or another," is so empowering. 14:25 And, you know, I'm, I'm wondering for you as you've now started to make decisions about what you'd like your future to look like, what parts of yourself do you feel, like, come alive when you think about, like, going back to Mexico, whether it's Puebla or somewhere else? 14:44 Hmm. That's such a beautiful question. One of the things that I first notice when I go to Mexico is just the pace. Things move so much slower. I think here in... As soon as I got back, you know, as soon as I... 14:57 'Cause I spent that, did go spend a month in Mexico in December, now I'm back in January. 15:01 It is just so much go, go, go, go, go, and it feels like you ha- you absolutely have to work at this pace to be able to afford rent, and living in a new city as expensive as Los Angeles, and being able to afford things like putting money away for your retirement or, like, you know, just trying to live a balanced life feels so like a rat race here. 15:23 In Mexico, I, it feels like just time moves a little bit slower. You could do with less. 15:28 You literally can do with less 'cause you probably have less money, but you also just don't need that much stuff that we're so, like, conditioned to think we need here. 15:36 I know you've talked about how you reinvented yourself in your 40s, and I'm interested to hear a little bit more about that. What did that mean, and what was the catalyst for that? Yeah. 15:49 I mean, I, I, I'm still living in the pandemic, honestly. 15:52 [laughs] I feel like the pandemic for me, and I think many people probably experienced it, sometimes you think it's just you, but I think everybody probably went through something like this. 16:01 It was very disruptive to my life. I was, up until that point, my career was go, go, go, high, high, like next role, next role up to the sky. 16:11 And at the time that the pandemic happened, I took on a, what I felt was a challenging role for myself to be an executive director of an organization. 16:19 Unfortunately, that organization's mission was to have 50 concerts in the summer, and that was on January 2020. [laughs] So that took, that, that was like a whoop, nosedive to my career. 16:31 And so like everybody, we were all forced to kinda slow down and reassess. And, you know, one of the things that I realized is how much I hate looking at emails all day, which is, which is what we do all day, right? 16:45 A lot of us. And so I was thinking, like, what are other things that I love? And I always feel joyful when I'm in a workout class, and I always feel joyful when I'm facilitating or leading. 16:56 So I decided that this is, it's something that I've always wanted to do, but like this was the time to do it, was to get certified so that I could do group fitness. 17:05 So that's something that is totally different than what I was doing, let's say, 10 years before that when I was in, like, corporate America. 17:12 So I'm very happy that this is something that I've cultivated for myself, is to do these, like, group fitness and ac- and doing active things like that. 17:22 And the other thing, too, that the pandemic facilitated for me is to dive even deeper into Tamarindo and making it a platform that's beyond the podcast. 17:31 So the retreats, thinking about events, just thinking of ways to monetize a little bit because it's still, it's still out of pocket and out of time. 17:39 [laughs] But it does, I feel that I was able to kinda spend a little more time on that and more, and other creative endeavors, like even taking like a... I still wanna do a creative writing class. 17:48 I haven't done that, but I did, like, a comedy writing class, and I've done a live storytelling class. 17:53 So just was able to explore these creative things that I didn't think I could ever find space for before the pandemic, before the pandemic forced me, and unemployment forced me. 18:05 [laughs] I love that so much because I feel like I've lived, like, 50 lives already. 18:11 I'm in my mid-30s right now, but one of the things that always fascinates me is listening to people in their, like, 20s talk about, "I can't wait till I'm 30, and I'm gonna have it figured out." And I'm like, "No. No. 18:23 [laughs] You don't have, reach a magical age where you figure it out, and you're also allowed to change your mind and change your life and change trajectories. 18:33 And-I'm so grateful to have landed in journalism, but that wasn't my original career path, you know? 18:39 And so I love this idea of, like, even in your 40s, just being able to say, like, "Wait, I actually don't enjoy sitting in front of a TV or computer screen all day and looking at emails. 18:50 This is actually something I'd rather do." And I think even now, I'm also learning, like, about myself and, like, the things that I really deeply value and the people who I wanna surround myself with, right? 19:05 So I, I love that. I- what, like, for you are some of the, like, myths or, yeah, myths about, like, aging and womanhood that you've had to kind of unlearn over the years? Yeah. 19:18 I mean, I'm so excited for you to be in your mid-30s and not yet in the 40s, because e- I feel like every year, two things are, have happened for me. Every year, I'm less sure about what I wanna be when I grow up. 19:28 [laughs] Instead of more sure, it's like less sure. But the other thing is that you really, like, the, the self-doubt and those, those like, "Am I doing this right? Am I on the right path?" 19:40 That voice that can be so intrusive just kinda keeps quieting down. So it's really one of the best parts about, [laughs] about aging. And the- and I hang out with people that feel that way. 19:53 You know, we're, my friends and I are... We are so focused on, like, fun and dancing, and l- and we don't care about, like, fashion and looking a certain way. 20:04 It's like, let's, how are we gonna get together and be comfortable and dance and enjoy delicious wine? That's the other thing that we're really into, is into natural wines. 20:12 [laughs] So I also really have appreciated my girlfriends, many of which are a little bit older than me too, that are in, uh, in their late 40s, maybe even some of them approaching 50. 20:22 Just the, the, the, like, I don't give a shit of... [laughs] That is so nice. It's just so nice to be, like, "Que me vale," right? Me- me vale energy. 20:32 [gentle music] That remind me of something I told someone recently, 'cause they were about to turn 30, and they're like, "You know, do things get easier?" 20:50 And I was like, "No, things don't get easier. You just become more equipped to deal- Mm... with the bullshit as it comes along now," right? 20:59 [laughs] Like, you get to basically deal with difficult things in life with different tools. And so I think it's kind of like what you're saying, you get so secure, you get so comfortable. 21:10 You have a much lower tolerance for things that are not conducive to your health and wellness. So I love that. I, I love that every decade kind of brings that, like, closer to that revelation. 21:21 What are some of the new things that you prioritize in your 40s that weren't really a big deal to you in your 30s? I think just, like, valuing time. 21:31 Just, we just talked about this on a episode of the Tamarindo, is like, that, that time really is all we have. And so how are we 21:40 being good guardians of our time and not wasting, wasting our time or spending on t- our time and energy, another word for this is energy, not wasting our energy on anything that just doesn't give us any joy, you know? 21:52 [laughs] So I'm ve- I think I'm, I'm, uh, mindful about my time, and I think, too, I mean, recognizing that rest is productive, right? 22:02 That, that going on a walk, if your body's calling for that walk, it's probably for more than just, like, "Oh, I need to get my steps." 22:10 It's like, you need to rechar- you need to, like, shake up your brain and, and give yourself that love. You give yourself love when you, when you do, when you do go on a walk, when you meet, talk with a friend. 22:21 It's just realizing that those things that might seem really small and trivial are actually productive and helpful, and will allow you to return back to your work, or your purpose, or whatever it is that you need to get back to in a way that you're gonna be more impactful. 22:35 So I think that's, that's kind of how I'm reorienting my life and my time. So give me a prediction. Where do you see yourself, like, another 10 years from now? 22:46 Where do you see the Tamarindo podcast another 10 years from now? Oh my gosh. I mean, if it was up to me, [laughs] 22:52 I, I would hope that by then maybe I have, like, this really awesome binational life where I am going back and forth for long periods of, of a ti- at a time. 23:03 Maybe it's having an international encuentro where the participants are both from... By the way, that's the name of our re- retreat. We call it Encuentro. 23:12 We have, like, this coming of m- may- you know, even, I'm, I'm thinking even bigger, because you're, you've given me a long time here. I know there's even, like, Latinas in Berlin, right? 23:22 [laughs] Tamarindo has allowed us to connect with so many different folks that are building community, like Latinas in Berlin, or Latinas in Europe, or Latinas everywhere. 23:31 So it's g- I, I can imagine, like, maybe we're doing something that's international or global. That would be phenomenal. That would be really cool. And then, I mean, I hope that I'm also 23:41 finding ways to stay in, in community or to stay involved. 23:46 So for instance, one of the things that when I move to Mexico, what I hope to do, and I've already connected with somebody that's doing this, there's this group called Retache Media that has been working on helping... 23:58 'Cause you know, right now there's people like me that are choosing to return to Mexico. There are people that don't have a choice and must be re- must return to Mexico. 24:05 There are people that know they're leaving, knowing they can never come back. So what resources and opportunities are there for those folks that are returning? And that's what Retache Media is focused on. Yeah. 24:16 So I hope to partner with them and, and do things in a responsible way. 24:19 Like, if I'm gonna come back, how do I do it in a way that, that I'm impacting the community in a positive way, not just in a way that feels like taking?Yeah, I've been thinking a little bit about that too because there is like this entire demographic of people who are, quote-unquote, "self-deporting," right? 24:38 And documenting that move, and some of those folk don't even speak Spanish. Some of them [chuckles] you know have never had a life outside of the US truly and so like where do they find community? 24:50 Where do they find employment opportunities? There's so many questions there, right? 24:54 And so I think you're gonna see like a big wave of like that sort of narrative happening in the, you know, definitely the next several years. But I think it's gonna have ripple effects. 25:05 You touched on this point earlier and I kinda wanted to bring this back to this specific subject, but you mentioned how like now it's harder than ever to find community because you can't just trust by default that like Latinos are all gonna be politically aligned. 25:20 And I've had this conversation with other guests because it has been really shocking to see a lot of like Latino ICE agents, a lot of very outspoken MAGA Latinos, you know, male Latino voters who supported the Trump administration. 25:37 Like, you know, so i- it's been a really interesting thing to not only like hear about, but then see play out in real life. I'm wondering for you, like how do you 25:50 vet the people that you wanna create community with and make sure that you are surrounding yourself with like-minded or politically a- aligned folks? Yeah, I mean I think it's... We- we've seen them. 26:03 There's lots of like Latina empowerment and Chinga- Chingona this and, you know, La- Latino that. It's like we have to take that little step further of like, okay, have they... 26:12 There'd be so many businesses even right now have, have done things for, you know, rai- raising money for people impacted by ICE. 26:20 So it's like if, if you're not like loud and proud [chuckles] against what's going on, I don't want... Like, I, look, you know, you know, I want nothing to do with you, to be honest. And I, and it's, it's... 26:30 I mean, I've been really suspicious. And I'll give you, I'm confessing here, here on, on your podcast. [chuckles] So one thing that I was observing, I was... Villa's Tacos, they have blown up, right? 26:41 I'm like, oh, there's another one. There's another one. There's another one. 26:44 And I've had the tacos and they're fantastic, but I had not noticed at least that they had been any, in any sort of way vocal about anything, right? 26:53 [chuckles] So I had been a little bit like not as excited as I wanna be about seeing this Latino business thrive. Of course, like everybody, I screamed at the TV when I saw them at the Bad Bunny show. 27:04 I was like, "Amazing, this is so great." 27:07 And I love that when the cat was out of the bag, right, when, when it was everybody knew that Villa's Tacos was there, the fir- the first thing that the person that appeared posted, you know, the owner of Villa's Tacos, the founder, is how he's the proud son of immigrants. 27:20 It's the, it's the first time that I saw at the very front and center recognition of his immigrant roots. Maybe not all the way like, "Fuck ICE." 27:29 I haven't seen that and I hope to see that, but this is kinda how I'm operating now. It's like it's not enough that you're- Yeah... that you're... You have a great brand, right? Latinos have... We have great looks. 27:40 We have great... You know, it's a great look. [chuckles] But how, what, what are you doing beyond that? How are you, how are you raising money, being loud, whatever? But you can't just stay silent, not right now. Yeah. 27:53 This is so interesting because I've had this debate a lot with people about how sometimes I feel like this idea of like Latino exceptionalism, it, it's so rooted in like respectability politics and it traps us. 28:08 It traps us into believing that we can't risk losing what we've built by speaking out about issues, right? 28:15 And so I, I think I'm seeing a lot more people now getting comfortable pushing the boundaries of that and taking those risks, but for a while it was like very much rooted in our psyche, right? 28:27 Because like our parents came here and they were taught assimilation as a survivalist tactic. So like then we learned that, and then we were told like, "Don't learn Spanish. Get rid of your accent. 28:38 Like do X, Y, and Z so that you can fit in and be successful in a professional setting." 28:45 And so now I'm seeing like the opposite of that happening, wealthier people who want their children to learn Spanish, they positions that pay more for Spanish language speakers. 28:55 You're seeing all of the, the, the cultural shift while there's still a lot of racism and white supremacy that exists. 29:02 And I'm wondering for you as someone who i- is a, an actual immigrant, right, like born and raised in Mexico, seeing that shift kind of happen and having to navigate the lines between those two world, where do you feel like you fall now? 29:17 Do you feel like you're seeing more people in support of like being outspoken about these issues and being proud of their culture and identity? Or do you think that people are still really scared? Well, c- couple things. 29:30 One is I came when I was four, so I'm mostly raised, mostly raised here. And I think too, there's, there's, like there's so much to unpack there because there's also... 29:40 I think what's at the bottom, at the core [chuckles] of a lot of what's happening is there's also a lot of anti-ingenuity, right? Which is a word that I have trouble pronouncing. But I, I, like 29:51 I recognize that even though I am formally undocumented and I ha- literally carry my passport with me, 29:58 I do know that maybe, especially 'cause I'm not a guy, I'm not a young man working, working outside, I know that I, I, I mean I, I walk with a level of, of security that ICE isn't probably gonna stop me, right? 30:10 [chuckles] So there's that. I think there's, we, we, we need to recognize that there's also racism in levels. 30:16 It's like because Latinos are so diverse, we're of, we're in every single shade and of every, in various races. 30:23 So I think there's also, like that's a factor as well, you know, that, that we all should be mindful of.I mean, I didn't, I don't feel that I grew up in a time that it was shameful at all to speak Spanish or anything. 30:36 I think it's always... I, I was trying to think about, is there ever a time in history where immigrants were viewed in a positive light? 30:44 [laughs] I think, I think in every situation, in everywhere in the world, I don't know if immigrants have ever had... The immigrants have always had a bad PR, right? Like, 30:53 so I just don't know if there's ever been a time in or any situation where... I, I guess I could think of one, although they're, I don't know if they're necessarily immigrants, but I'm thinking of, of Argentina. 31:03 You know, they needed to bring some Italians and people to populate the land [laughs]. So maybe there are instances where immigration is, is welcome. 31:12 But I think in general, there's always going to be a, a need to remind people of the impact of immigrants, the value of them as human beings, but also as an economic engine and all the things that we can provide. 31:29 I think that's always sort of gonna be an issue, [laughs] that, that, that I can't think of a time where that's not a problem. 31:36 So anyways, it's kind of like a long-winded way to, way to say that I recognize where I sit in all this, and I recognize that the fact that I've never felt shame about speaking Spanish or accents doesn't mean that it's not something that's a real lived experience for many different people. 31:54 But I do think that we are at a turning point now, right? Where you're, if you, like kind of what we just talked about, if you're not saying this is a line too far, this is unacceptable, what is wrong with you? 32:08 [laughs] You know, what is wrong with you? And I think, I think people should pay financially. 32:13 Like if you're rest- if you're a restaurant owner, we should not be supporting restaurant owners that are Latinos but not really down. [laughs] You know? 32:19 I think we really, we really need to kind of be very critical of how we spend our, our dollars, our energy, or what we amplify, and just take that extra step of looking in just a little further. 32:31 I think so many people have grown a platform and support and achieved success through, like, local immigrant Latino communities, so it's the bare minimum to be outspoken right now. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But yeah. 32:48 Thank you so much for sharing all of that. I'd love to leave you with the last word. 32:52 Is there anything that you feel like you'd like to express or share or even talk about that's coming up that you'd like folks to know about? 32:59 Thank you so much for this opportunity, and I, I'll give you, like, this is kind of full circle, the Latino Newsletter in a way, because literally the, I want to say within the months that Tamarindo started, Julio Ricardo Varela somehow learned about Tamarindo and had me on the Latino Rebels, you know, which was 33:17 kind of a, a predecessor to the Latino Newsletter. 33:20 And so it is sort of, like, exciting to see, first of all, like, the evolution and, and that you are the host of this podcast, so I think that's phenomenal, and you starting on this journey in podcasting. 33:31 I think it's so fantastic. 33:33 And I, and I love, I love the, it's a small universe, but the s- the universe of Latina, Latine, Latino podcasters that are also like-minded, that are, that are also using this method, this platform to talk, to push against what's happening, to lift up the change makers. 33:52 I mean, there might be few listeners, you know [laughs], but I know that they're out there and that we're making a difference. We're making an impact. 34:00 So I just wanna congratulate you on your work in this role and, you know, kind of in a way, Julio Ricardo Varela passing the mic, so shout out to him and everybody involved with this. 34:09 And then in just quick shout out for something that we do have coming up. We are doing Encuentro again, so this will be our third time u- doing it, and it's gonna be April 30th through May 4th. 34:20 If you have any questions at all about, about Tamarindo, about starting a podcast, about Encuentro, people can find my contact information at our website, which is tamarindopodcast.com. Perfect. 34:33 Thank you so much for being here, and until next time, this is the Latino Newsletter Podcast. Thank you. 34:39 [upbeat music] This episode of the Latino Newsletter Podcast was produced by Joaquin Kotler, Juan Diego Ramirez, and Michelle Zacarias, with editorial support from Edward Wilkie. 34:54 Julio Ricardo Varela edited the conversation. The music is by Cast of Characters via Soundstripe. Season 2 of the Latino Newsletter Podcast was made possible through individual gifts and the Latino Media Consortium. 35:07 The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the guests and hosts and don't necessarily reflect those of the Latino Newsletter or its staff. 35:14 [upbeat music]
